Check out Chess with Different Armies, our featured variant for July, 2024.

[ Help | Earliest Comments | Latest Comments ]
[ List All Subjects of Discussion | Create New Subject of Discussion ]
[ List Latest Comments Only For Pages | Games | Rated Pages | Rated Games | Subjects of Discussion ]

Comments/Ratings for a Single Item

Later Reverse Order Earlier
Griffon. Historic piece that steps one space diagonally then slides like a Rook.[All Comments] [Add Comment or Rating]
H. G. Muller wrote on Tue, Oct 24, 2023 01:06 PM UTC in reply to H. G. Muller from 09:20 AM:

I have shaped up the article a bit (margins around the image, and a typo), changed the explanation about the irreversibility diagram such that the Griffon did not come from a square where it could capture the King (b1), and added a link to a Checkmating Applet that can handle bent riders. (Which I uploaded for the purpose.)

For now that Applet is hard-coded for doing a Griffon, as I took out all piece-selection buttons to make it look to the EGT page we already have. I am not sure whether we will need it for other pieces. The Ostrich (A-then-R) can checkmate, but I don't think we have a Piececlopedia page for that. The Applet doesn't do lame pieces, so it cannot handle the Hippogrif. It might be able to do the jumping version (which on a near-empty board would be nearly the same). It can also do the Ski-Rook (which is a sort of degenerate bent slider, D-then-R). But we also don't have a Piececlopedia page for ski pieces.

H. G. Muller wrote on Tue, Oct 24, 2023 09:20 AM UTC in reply to Diceroller is Fire from Mon Oct 23 07:43 PM:

On 8x8 the Griffon turned out to be nearly one Pawn weaker than a Queen. Both Queen and Griffon are pieces with sliding moves in 8 directions, making their value scale similarly with board size. (This in contrast to slider-leaper compounts like Chancellor and Archbishop, which will lose value compared to the Queen when board size increases.)

The Queen has a big advantage over the Griffon on sparsely populated boards: it can make distant attacks from 8 directions rather than 4, and can also switch easily between those directions, even between the orthogonal ones. (E.g. an attack on e2 from a2 can on the next move come from e6 through a diagonal move.) This makes perpetual checking, or manoeuvring with checking moves to create attacks on other squares) much easier for the Queen. A check by a Griffon from a2 on a King at e1 can, after Ke2 only be renewed by checking again from the left. There is no way to switch to checking along a file.

Although the Checkmating Applets here cannot do bent sliders (I could not figure out a way for the user to specify those in the move-definition aid), there exists a version that can do this on my own website. (Where the piece is selected by buttons, and you cannot specify your own.) By playing with black there you can see how this 'tunnel drive' indeed often provides the fastest way to checkmate.

[Thought: perhaps we should copy those versions of the EGT builder here too, making the piece(s) selectable through the URL's query string rather than through the buttons, so that we can link the Griffon page to a checkmating applet too. I also have a 3-vs-1 Applet there that can handle hoppers and bent sliders (that cannot checkmate by themselves, such as W-then-B) as one of the pieces. It might be more difficult to utilize that in a sensible way with piece articles, as the mate would require a second piece.]

Diceroller is Fire wrote on Mon, Oct 23, 2023 07:43 PM UTC:Good ★★★★

This piece has the power of Queen. And I’ve found a checkmating tactic for the piece which controls the spaces around the files/ranks such as Aanca, Magician and one my piece I currently omit. This tactic appears in K vs K + piece endgames and is called wind tunnel (aerodynamic tunnel). Piece confines the King in a file/rank between its covered lines, and then your King drives it to the last rank, but to avoid stalemate, you should then cut off the previous-to-last line to avoid escaping of opponent’s King. But it’s better to firstly drive them as far as you can from board center and then confine into tunnel. For Aanca it’s possible on normal board, but less possible for Magician, though you shouldn’t forget that both these pieces are from games with 12x12 board.

George Duke wrote on Tue, Oct 11, 2016 04:09 PM UTC:

The Hippogriff of Tamerlane Chess is explained on the same Griffon page of Jeremy Good. Hippogriff moves like earlier Gryphon/Griffon/(different spellings), but is excluded from the nearby squares, that is those within the 7x7 square perimeter. Since also blockable, Hippogriff is subset of Gryphon.

1283 was year of publication of Grande Acedrez with first use of Gryphon. Timur Lenk, inventor of namesake Timur's or Tamerlane Chess (1336-1405) has Giraffe as Hippogriff, the classic Gryphon that is excluded from those near squares. So there was a hundred years to ponder better implementation of Gryphon into Hippogriff. We can presume intellectual transfer of ideas from Spain to Persia, just as there was trade continually between Inuit Arctic and Siberia.,isz:l&ved=0ahUKEwi_5f-G2pzQAhXoyFQKHRL7APsQ2A4IHigE&biw=1920&bih=974#imgrc=Ackhrp7O_-BASM%3A

David Paulowich wrote on Mon, Jan 22, 2007 01:26 PM UTC:

QUOTE: 'In the diagram below, white has just moved his Griffon from b1 to a6.'

Yes, the Black King on c5 would have already been in check from a Griffon on b1. We should change the starting square of the Griffon to f5, making everything legal.

Anonymous wrote on Sun, Jan 21, 2007 03:19 PM UTC:
I was talking about a gryphon on b1, not a6. From b1, it can move diagonally to c2, then continue straight upward to c5. Note that no pieces obstruct this movement. Also, according to the description, black's king would have to have been on c5 when the gryphon was on b1.

John Ayer wrote on Tue, Jan 16, 2007 02:07 AM UTC:
The griffon is not a leaper, so the black king is not in check.

Anonymous wrote on Sun, Jan 14, 2007 10:18 PM UTC:Good ★★★★
In the 6x6-board demonstration of the gryphon's move, an impossible situation is shown. A gryphon at b1 checks the king at c5 (and - irrelevantly- attacks the rook on g2). If the black king is in check on white's move, white can simply take the black king! This is illegal, and implies that the black king either moved into check or refused to move out of it(both of which are illegal).

Anonymous wrote on Tue, Sep 17, 2002 09:29 AM UTC:
Zurafa is arabic meaning giraffe (and being the etymological 
source for the word 'giraffe').

--Jörg Knappen

Anonymous wrote on Mon, Sep 16, 2002 07:42 AM UTC:
zurafa means giraffe in some oriental languages (without checking
I am not sure which ones apply).

--JÖorg Knappen

William Overington wrote on Sat, Sep 14, 2002 03:26 PM UTC:Excellent ★★★★★
Can anyone say what is the meaning of the word zurafa please?  I have
looked in a number of web dictionaries but cannot find it.

Anonymous wrote on Fri, Sep 13, 2002 06:31 AM UTC:
I propose renaming the piece described here
as hippogriff into zurafa. This term is used by Jellis
to discriminate the Tamerlane chess piece from the 
giraffe ((1,4)-leaper).

Jörg Knappen

📝Ben Good wrote on Tue, Jul 23, 2002 03:38 PM UTC:
there is a remark on spelling.  i consulted several dictionaries on
spelling and i found virtually no indication that any particular spelling
is preferred.  i used 'griffon' because it's the one i've run into the
most in my life.  'gryphion' does not show up in the dictionary i have
here, altho it is not an unabridged dictionary, so i will have to check
another dictionary when i get a chance.

i can add mention of hadden's games to the page.  keeping track of what
pieces appear in what games is an extremely difficult proccess.

Anonymous wrote on Tue, Jul 23, 2002 02:09 PM UTC:Good ★★★★
I think there should be a remark on spelling, the word griffin (my
prefferred spelling) occurs on as griffin, griffon,

gryphon or even gryphion (and probably other variations as well). Grffins
and hippogriffs also occur in Mark heedens Io chess, the griffin is also
Ganymede chess and Europan chess.

Mark Heddens hippogriff is Griffin + Rook (a Reaper in Ralph Betza's
tripunch chess) -- so different from the hippogriff described here.

A last note: The griffin is also a heraldic animal, and artist (making
chess fonts or variant chess set) may want to look at -- nice
griffin art.

--J'org Knappen

Jean-Louis Cazaux wrote on Tue, Jul 23, 2002 11:22 AM UTC:Excellent ★★★★★
This page, and all which are related, is very well done.
I love the Griffon with its asymetrical move which makes it so
I use it in my variants and I would like to mention that I also use a
 'half-griffon', that I name a 'Ship' in my TAMERLANE 2000 and GIGACHESS
The Ship is a kind of vertical-only Griffon, a nice (not too strong) piece

for fork attack. Also asymetrical, like a Ship which can not easily
against the wind...
The Ship is between the Bishop and the Rook in term of power.

15 comments displayed

Later Reverse Order Earlier

Permalink to the exact comments currently displayed.